amin
Aug 19, 09:42 AM
You make good points. I guess we'll learn more as more information becomes available.
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
Intarweb
Apr 27, 08:04 AM
I wonder if this is why I can no longer get more than a days charge on my iPhone 4 with minimal use since it seems like it's an always on thing.
.gif "cute coloring pages of easter")
benthewraith
Nov 28, 08:07 PM
I agree with the people here who have said that if this happens they would pirate all of the Music that they wanted from universal. If this happens and I buy a new iPod after that I will just go and pirate the Music that I want since the record labels have already been paid.
You could have a subpoena on you the moment you do (and it would not be an effective defense if you had posts such as these in public forums. Did you know that bots go to forums?).
I just wouldn't buy anything more from Universal. There are plenty of bands in Jacksonville to fill my iPod up (and Yellowcard isn't contracted with Universal! :D).
You could have a subpoena on you the moment you do (and it would not be an effective defense if you had posts such as these in public forums. Did you know that bots go to forums?).
I just wouldn't buy anything more from Universal. There are plenty of bands in Jacksonville to fill my iPod up (and Yellowcard isn't contracted with Universal! :D).
rdowns
Apr 28, 06:29 PM
Look...I'll be the first to admit..there are some wacko Christians out there..like this dude from florida who burned the Quran..i mean wth was he thinking? but we're not all wacko as alot of you suggest... the posts a lot of people on here make, lump ALL of us together. And thats just not cool...
Same goes for conservatives and tea party members...Yes a lot of tea party members are quite radical. But not ALL of them you can probably safely say 99% of racists would consider themselves tea party..but that doesn�t mean everyone in the tea party is racist...
Consider this please before any of you go lumping all of a particular group into one derogatory name..
And I see you throw a liberal label on anyone you disagree with so please spare me Mr. Kettle.
Same goes for conservatives and tea party members...Yes a lot of tea party members are quite radical. But not ALL of them you can probably safely say 99% of racists would consider themselves tea party..but that doesn�t mean everyone in the tea party is racist...
Consider this please before any of you go lumping all of a particular group into one derogatory name..
And I see you throw a liberal label on anyone you disagree with so please spare me Mr. Kettle.
layte
Mar 31, 03:52 PM
You're moving the goal posts. That always has been the wonderful thing about the words "open" and "free" with respect to software. They never really meant much but had such loaded connotations. You can change the definition mid-argument as easily as you change what hat you're wearing.
I look ace in a Trilby.
You know, projecting isn't healthy at all.
You'd best stop then old fella (yea, I can play forum clich�d response 101 as well, /tips-hat)
I look ace in a Trilby.
You know, projecting isn't healthy at all.
You'd best stop then old fella (yea, I can play forum clich�d response 101 as well, /tips-hat)
NickPill
Aug 7, 10:55 PM
Hi, this is just a question to the developers. Did you already get 10.5? I have the ADC Select membership but can�t find 10.5 in the download section. Please send me an email where I can find it. Thank you!
MadeTheSwitch
Apr 27, 08:31 AM
He shouldn't have given in to the racists. But it's out there. Now will Donald Trump and all of these other racist *******s please shut the hell up?
Of course they won't. Now they will state that it isn't real, no doubt. But that's fine. The more that Trump crows about such issues, the more foolish he makes himself and the entire Republican party look.
Of course they won't. Now they will state that it isn't real, no doubt. But that's fine. The more that Trump crows about such issues, the more foolish he makes himself and the entire Republican party look.
NY Guitarist
Apr 5, 07:36 PM
Also, I'm waiting for the RED Scarlet camera to hit the market, and have heard speculation that RED and Apple will release a new highly efficient compression codec based on RED's Redcode called REDRay.
The speculation is that REDRay will be used for everything from 4K DCP playback in movie theaters to a download/streaming version that will be usable for buying up to 4K movies through iTunes.
RED hired plugin developer Graeme Nattress awhile ago and he has been pushing the REDcode science forward with excellent results.
The speculation is that REDRay will be used for everything from 4K DCP playback in movie theaters to a download/streaming version that will be usable for buying up to 4K movies through iTunes.
RED hired plugin developer Graeme Nattress awhile ago and he has been pushing the REDcode science forward with excellent results.
Porchland
Aug 7, 03:23 PM
The photo templates in Mail look pretty nifty. The ability to crop and scale inside a pre-defined space would make a nice new feature for iPhoto books, so I suspect we may see more of this feature in iPhoto when iLife refreshes in January.
The improved functionality in Mail looks great!
The improved functionality in Mail looks great!
jaxstate
Aug 11, 10:57 AM
That would be awesome.
It seems to me that there may be two phones coming here. I wouldn't be surprised if one has a full keyboard, either on touchscreen or using conventional buttons, and one is simpler.
It seems to me that there may be two phones coming here. I wouldn't be surprised if one has a full keyboard, either on touchscreen or using conventional buttons, and one is simpler.
lazyrighteye
Aug 11, 05:34 PM
Hahahha coverage maps don't mean jack.Everyone in the wireless business knows they are gross approximations of the reality.
cute coloring pages of easter
cute coloring pages of easter
Mr_Ed
Jul 20, 08:39 AM
I wonder what they're going to call them, Quad sounds cool but "Octa or Octo" just sounds a bit silly.
MacPro8?
The Mactopus??
I got it!
The Macintosh Quadra!
No, wait . . . .
;)
MacPro8?
The Mactopus??
I got it!
The Macintosh Quadra!
No, wait . . . .
;)
steve knight
Mar 18, 12:50 AM
Ron Paul is a Christian nutjob. a squirrels wet dream.
He wants a small government small enough to fit in the bedroom and between a woman's legs. I love the small govement thing but then there are all these things government should control.
cute easter bunnies coloring
cute easter bunny coloring
cute coloring pages of easter
Cute Easter Bunny Dropping
cute easter bunnies coloring
It Is A Cute Bunny.
He wants a small government small enough to fit in the bedroom and between a woman's legs. I love the small govement thing but then there are all these things government should control.
FriarNurgle
Apr 27, 08:17 AM
for all the tin foil hatters out there, what will happen to the phone performance when the location services are turned off?
Unspeaked
Sep 19, 12:30 PM
P
All you people trying to make us feel like complete morons for waiting and wanting a new (AND BETTER) chip, what's wrong with you?! Did you just buy a MBP and feel the need to piss on everyone that is about to get a beter machine than you? Or is it just PMS or some other hormonal condition?
As I said earlier in this thread, Playstation was far from first to market.
Video game systems aside, what the people saying "quit complaining about Apple's lack of a C2D notebook" are driving at is that more than once, someone posts something along the lines of, "Man, I needed a new laptop three months ago for my school project - I've been slaving away on my PowerBook 1400 waiting for the new MacBookPro Painted Aluminum C2D... but there's no way I'm going to give Apple the satisfaction of caving in now!" when in reality, they time they would have saved in the past three months alone using the Intel machine over the PPC machine, not posting 12x a day asking when the Core2Duo laptops are out, etc, etc would be more than enough to make up for the measly 10% real world performance increase they'll get for a machine that's already missed 3 or 4 rumor announcement dates and has no guarantee of being out in the next month!
All you people trying to make us feel like complete morons for waiting and wanting a new (AND BETTER) chip, what's wrong with you?! Did you just buy a MBP and feel the need to piss on everyone that is about to get a beter machine than you? Or is it just PMS or some other hormonal condition?
As I said earlier in this thread, Playstation was far from first to market.
Video game systems aside, what the people saying "quit complaining about Apple's lack of a C2D notebook" are driving at is that more than once, someone posts something along the lines of, "Man, I needed a new laptop three months ago for my school project - I've been slaving away on my PowerBook 1400 waiting for the new MacBookPro Painted Aluminum C2D... but there's no way I'm going to give Apple the satisfaction of caving in now!" when in reality, they time they would have saved in the past three months alone using the Intel machine over the PPC machine, not posting 12x a day asking when the Core2Duo laptops are out, etc, etc would be more than enough to make up for the measly 10% real world performance increase they'll get for a machine that's already missed 3 or 4 rumor announcement dates and has no guarantee of being out in the next month!
Vegasman
Apr 27, 11:29 AM
Apple provides the option of encrypting your backups. I suggest that anyone concerned about the safety of their personal information use this feature.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
In computer security class they will teach you to secure personal information by default. And if necessary to provide an option to unsecure it. I am sure Apple knows this. For some reason they chose not to follow this advice.
They are now fixing the problem. There is no need to defend them.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
In computer security class they will teach you to secure personal information by default. And if necessary to provide an option to unsecure it. I am sure Apple knows this. For some reason they chose not to follow this advice.
They are now fixing the problem. There is no need to defend them.
840quadra
Apr 25, 03:10 PM
statistics show that distribution of firearms mainly lead to more homocides and also suicides using firearms.
if guns are outlawed, their distribution is greatly limited, making it a lot harder for outlaws to obtain them.
the more you spread guns, the greater is the risk of them being used in illegal activities.
..oh wait... this forum is about apple and computers, right? :rolleyes:
Noted,
But this is totally off topic, and this falls into the relm of Politics, Religion, Social Issues (http://forums.macrumors.com/forumdisplay.php?f=47) .
When you have a high enough post count, I am sure a few of us would love to discuss the inaccuracies of the facts you think you understand on this subject. ;) .
if guns are outlawed, their distribution is greatly limited, making it a lot harder for outlaws to obtain them.
the more you spread guns, the greater is the risk of them being used in illegal activities.
..oh wait... this forum is about apple and computers, right? :rolleyes:
Noted,
But this is totally off topic, and this falls into the relm of Politics, Religion, Social Issues (http://forums.macrumors.com/forumdisplay.php?f=47) .
When you have a high enough post count, I am sure a few of us would love to discuss the inaccuracies of the facts you think you understand on this subject. ;) .
dscuber9000
Apr 6, 01:41 PM
An Android tablet just seems a little weird to me. Android is an OS for people that basically want a super-custromizable and super-complicated OS on the go. Tablets are great for people that still can't set the time on their VCR (and they still have a VCR plugged in). I'm not surprised that there isn't much of a market for Android tablets.
This goes well with what Steve Wozniak said yesterday.
This goes well with what Steve Wozniak said yesterday.
erockerboy
Aug 17, 01:07 PM
Great post - you said it all.
I think everyone has to remember that Apple took a HUGE PR risk by switching to intel and that it would be foolish to think that they didn't have a VERY GOOD REASON for doing it. As much as RISC is loved here, there really is no compelling reason to think that the G5 architecture stands much of a chance in this comparison. Furthermore, it is foolish to assume that a "up-to-date" G5 would fare any better, firstly because IBM has never stopped developing the G5 (its primary usage was IBM blade servers after all) and secondly because the Core 2 architecture as it stands now isn't being pushed to perform at its maximum levels. In the end, arrogance and pride has never helped anyone, its time to let go.
I think everyone has to remember that Apple took a HUGE PR risk by switching to intel and that it would be foolish to think that they didn't have a VERY GOOD REASON for doing it. As much as RISC is loved here, there really is no compelling reason to think that the G5 architecture stands much of a chance in this comparison. Furthermore, it is foolish to assume that a "up-to-date" G5 would fare any better, firstly because IBM has never stopped developing the G5 (its primary usage was IBM blade servers after all) and secondly because the Core 2 architecture as it stands now isn't being pushed to perform at its maximum levels. In the end, arrogance and pride has never helped anyone, its time to let go.
Vegasman
Apr 27, 08:40 AM
Apple's solution is fine by me. They wouldn't have done anything if there wasn't so much press about it, but I guess that's a good reason (one of the only ones) for the press to exist.
Interestingly, this behavior of waiting for things to blow up in the press before they are addressed will only lead to MORE things getting blown up in the press. Maybe Apple likes that? I dunno.
Interestingly, this behavior of waiting for things to blow up in the press before they are addressed will only lead to MORE things getting blown up in the press. Maybe Apple likes that? I dunno.
jjthomps
Nov 28, 09:37 PM
When is there going to be a tell all book/movie about how the media giants are run like mafias?
Oh yeah, there won't. Nobody wants to sleep with the fishes.
So does this mean that 10 years from now your pianos will come with a $1.00 vend so that you can play a song that may have been produced by Universal, or maybe not produced by them.
These people who don't actually create anything, never lifted a brush, never sang a song, never hammered a nail, have their pale thin hands out for everything and everyway their content can be played. They have their fingers into everything. Look at the way that strores have to pay them off just to play their music over their speakers. Isn't that good old fashion advertising, and the fees should be reversed?
I'm really happy to say that I am not directly involved within such a corrupt industry.
Oh yeah, there won't. Nobody wants to sleep with the fishes.
So does this mean that 10 years from now your pianos will come with a $1.00 vend so that you can play a song that may have been produced by Universal, or maybe not produced by them.
These people who don't actually create anything, never lifted a brush, never sang a song, never hammered a nail, have their pale thin hands out for everything and everyway their content can be played. They have their fingers into everything. Look at the way that strores have to pay them off just to play their music over their speakers. Isn't that good old fashion advertising, and the fees should be reversed?
I'm really happy to say that I am not directly involved within such a corrupt industry.
Jpoon
Jun 8, 08:30 PM
I would rather just order it online if I didn't want to drive to an Apple Store.
Seriously, RadioShack needs to die.
Seriously, RadioShack needs to die.
ThomasJL
Mar 26, 09:07 AM
I really want Lion, for the number one reason being TRIM support. I eagerly want to finally start using an SSD (specifically one from Crucial, since they make the fastest ones on the market), but have avoided doing so since the latest version Snow Leopard does not support TRIM.
It's a shame Apple is waiting so long to finally include TRIM support. Windows 7 already includes it.
I think I'll wait until 10.7.3 comes out before upgrading, though. If there are bugs in the TRIM implementation, I fear it may corrupt data.
It's a shame Apple is waiting so long to finally include TRIM support. Windows 7 already includes it.
I think I'll wait until 10.7.3 comes out before upgrading, though. If there are bugs in the TRIM implementation, I fear it may corrupt data.
macfan881
Aug 6, 08:24 PM
I'm hoping for a major bombshell of an announcement when it comes to Leopard. I've said it before and I will say it again - the gap between Windows and OS X will narrow with Vista. Yes we are all aware that Vista in all likelihood is going to be just as buggy as 10.0 when it was released. But keep in mind that this will probably be the last version of OS X to be released for the next 18+ months. (When its all said and done its prob going to be close to 2 years with 10.4->10.5) That time frame is more then enough time for MS to release SP1 and SP2 which WILL happen once its released, the general public (a.k.a Beta testers.) get their hands on it, and MS starts getting those crash reports.
Leopard needs to go up against MS's next generation and to be honest while 10.4 vs. XP is a non contest the same can't be said between 10.4 and Vista. That gap is narrowed. Apple needs to do something more then Expose, Spotlight, Dashboard, icon changes, and migrating more and more of their graphic subsystem onto the video card. All of those changes are good and worthy additions to OS X but it's incremental. It's Apple doing cleanup from the days of 10.0. It's Apple resting on their laurels. This simply can't happen anymore. The gap between Windows and OS X NEEDS to widen again. If it doesn't the "its good enough" mentality that many PC users have will only increase because like it or not Vista IS a major revamp of Windows under the hood. Yes a revamp with many key missing technologies but a revamp of the core OS nonetheless.
We need something that was as revolutionary as 9.x ->10.0. While I'm under no illusions that Apple isn't ready to revamp the entire GUI they HAVE to have been working on new stuff over the last 6 years. There has to be something that almost done baking in the bowels of Cupertino that can make it into 10.5.
PS- Please Apple; FTFF.
i agree i think there will be something unexpected we didnt think of for leapord maybe that would be full native suport of windows programs with out dual booting something like parcells sp? or even possible we finaly get a media center type of system we heard rumors about to
Leopard needs to go up against MS's next generation and to be honest while 10.4 vs. XP is a non contest the same can't be said between 10.4 and Vista. That gap is narrowed. Apple needs to do something more then Expose, Spotlight, Dashboard, icon changes, and migrating more and more of their graphic subsystem onto the video card. All of those changes are good and worthy additions to OS X but it's incremental. It's Apple doing cleanup from the days of 10.0. It's Apple resting on their laurels. This simply can't happen anymore. The gap between Windows and OS X NEEDS to widen again. If it doesn't the "its good enough" mentality that many PC users have will only increase because like it or not Vista IS a major revamp of Windows under the hood. Yes a revamp with many key missing technologies but a revamp of the core OS nonetheless.
We need something that was as revolutionary as 9.x ->10.0. While I'm under no illusions that Apple isn't ready to revamp the entire GUI they HAVE to have been working on new stuff over the last 6 years. There has to be something that almost done baking in the bowels of Cupertino that can make it into 10.5.
PS- Please Apple; FTFF.
i agree i think there will be something unexpected we didnt think of for leapord maybe that would be full native suport of windows programs with out dual booting something like parcells sp? or even possible we finaly get a media center type of system we heard rumors about to